Windows 10, version 1809 released

[exile360]

Heads up, yet another major issue with MS' latest Windows 10 update.

In my opinion, this is the problem with attempting to keep everyone on a single OS/platform while still attempting to overhaul it to the extent that would previously be limited to new OS versions.  Just imagine the chaos had MS rolled out an update for Windows 7 that basically turned it into 8 because of all the new "features" added to it.  In theory, maintaining the same OS/kernel/codebase sounds like a good idea for long term compatibility and hardware support, but the fact of the matter is, as MS overhauls so much on the surface and especially under the hood of their "final" Windows version, they are going to continue to attempt to make major sweeping changes that are going to break compatibility with tons of hardware devices and software configurations, and that's why I believe all these issues have been cropping up with the latest creators' update.

[nukecad]

It's a good point.

In the past most (home) users would never change their OS, they would stick with whatever was on the computer when they bought it.

The only time an OS was changed was when you bought a new computer, with new hardware that was compatible with the new OS.

Pushing out automatic major OS updates to Win10 home users (with no choice) means that you are going to eventually be pushing them out to incompatible hardware.

It's a situation that can only get worse in future.

Android gets away with constant major OS updates because people like to buy the latest new phone every year.
If you don't then Android apps stop working properly on your 'old' phone with an old Android OS.

Maybe that's what MS are trying to push towards, buy a new computer/laptop every year or two?

Edited November 30, 2018 by nukecad

[exile360]

Exactly, and what's worse, when you do end up with hardware incompatibilities like they've had with this update (the Realtek HD Audio issues, among other things) and as they drop support for particular older hardware, we'll end up with a wide array of Windows 10 versions installed, but technically they're all Windows 10 so it's going to make third party OS support a nightmare.  As I recall MS has already stated that as releases go out for new versions, they will be restricting which users are able to "upgrade" and which ones are not (I'm not sure if it's based on hardware support, a planned ongoing subscription fee, or something else, but I remember reading it in an article about 10 early on) so again, we'll end up with users who all think they have the same OS because it is all technically Windows 10, but in reality, thanks to changes in their subsequent releases/versions, different systems will be running completely different versions of the operating system.

[nukecad]

I'm not sure that the name is that much of a problem, people have already got used to stating which version and build number they are running.

I've also seen somewhere that in future they are planning to drop the '10' and it'll just be called 'Windows'.

The bit about restricting upgrades, if I remember right, was supposed to be done by checking your hardware in the weeks before an upgrade and if it wasn't compatible then you wouldn't get the automatic upgrade. (Until changes had been made to it).
Which is why you see home users still on 'old' Windows 10 versions now and again.
(One of my friends was stuck on 1511 for a while until I manually updated her to 1703, it's been updating since but she still hasn't been offered 1809 yet).

Like I say it's the same as you see with Android, some devices are 'stuck' with old versions and will never get updated because their hardware is not compatible.
My Galaxy SIII is Android 4.1.2. and that's never going to update. (Unless I take a chance and hack it to a later version).

[exile360]

Yeah, but the problem is if software developers continue to support exclusive APIs and features in their newer product versions but just say "compatible with Windows 10" it's going to create confusion, and I'd bet money not nearly as many users as you might think pay attention to the build number that they're running.  If Microsoft drops the 10 and just starts calling it "Windows" that's going to be even worse.  They really need to get back to major names/service pack levels or something to more easily differentiate between their OS versions, at least in my opinion.  Especially if the shell/UI is going to remain the same going forward.

With Android it's the same thing.  They use different names to differentiate between the builds like "Jellybean" and such.  With Mac OSX it's the names of various cats (until they finally move onto OS11, which I heard they plan to do soon, having run out of big cat names).

Edited December 2, 2018 by exile360

[Amaroq_Starwind]

Oh, it still has bugs, but the most abhorrent one is gone at least.

[Firefox]

On ‎11‎/‎30‎/‎2018 at 8:18 AM, exile360 said:

so it's going to make third party OS support a nightmare.

We are already seeing this as an issue with our accounting software.  If we upgrade past 1709, the accounting software does not work on some of its features, not sure what changed between 1803 and 1809, but I can not upgrade to those versions unless I want to halt the accounting department to a halt. Sage (maker of the accounting software is no help either)

[exile360]

2 hours ago, Firefox said:

We are already seeing this as an issue with our accounting software.  If we upgrade past 1709, the accounting software does not work on some of its features, not sure what changed between 1803 and 1809, but I can not upgrade to those versions unless I want to halt the accounting department to a halt. Sage (maker of the accounting software is no help either)

Yep, that's exactly the kind of issue I'm talking about.  Microsoft isn't stating as much, but they are in fact altering Windows at significant levels, changing and adding/removing core features and functions in the OS with these updates; changes that would never make it into standard Windows Updates in any past OS they've released save for the occasional Service Pack which only shipped once every year or two, and even then, those issues were generally few and far between save for changes which were required to correct major security flaws (like their changes to the Windows Firewall in XP SP2 to defend against the kinds of rampant attacks we saw with the Sasser and Blaster worms back then) and any major architectural changes were held back for future Windows versions like Vista+, but with them continuing to call it Windows 10 even when making such changes under the hood and on the surface of the interface, it's virtually impossible to know whether or not your existing software and hardware configuration will function properly once the next Creator's Update ships, with each one dropping every 6 months based on their stated schedule.  They really should be re-branding it, at least to something more transparent like they did with 8 to 8.1 (i.e. 10.1, 10.2 etc.) so that they and third party developers and vendors can be clear about what OS version is installed and is supported.

The idea that just because they still call it Windows 10 and the taskbar etc. still look the same that it is still the same OS with the same level of functionality and compatibility is a total fallacy and Microsoft knows it, but they are dead set on this course of claiming that they've published the "last" version of Windows while continuing to make compatibility breaking changes under the hood with each update released.

Edited December 5, 2018 by exile360

[Amaroq_Starwind]

Even Apple is a lot better about this. Should we go about with starting a petition?

[Firefox]

Also I am not happy with the forced upgrade either.... its hard to keep those computers on 1709 because if I upgrade stuff breaks...

[Amaroq_Starwind]

There's a helpful utility on the Windows Store called WIndows Update Manager, which can not only prevent update errors, but also has workarounds to issues that can prevent successfully updating. Unfortunately though, the program hasn't been updated in years and has a tendency to crash if you try to run it in the background, and it also only runs on x64. When my father first configured my laptop before I usurped it, he had mistakenly installed Windows 10 32-Bit, and that's what I've been stuck with since then... I might switch to 64-Bit once I upgrade the this thing to use an SSD; the 160 gigabyte Hard Disk it currently uses is horrifically antiquated.