Can somebody please tell me if this is normal?

[nov1]

Hi all ?

I have my  new 4G wifi device connected to my desktop computer as an Ethernet connection, and I have noticed that my network "number" keeps increasing. For example, when I first set up my Ethernet connection to my desktop computer, it was listed as 'Network 2',  just shortly after that it has got its way to  'Network 8'.

I usually switch off and unplug my device overnight, and I'm thinking that sometimes when I plug the device back in to the USB port in the morning, the network number increases by 1.

e.g   like from network 2,  to then network 3, to then network 4, and so on.

 

 

Is this normal behaviour guys?  Thanks in advanced!! 

 

 

 

[nukecad]

Yes Windows 10 does it all the time when you tether a device via USB.

It's always on Ethernet2, but the Network number increases over time. (I've see posts from users with 'Network 150' or higher).
From my own use it seems to be after a shutdown you sometimes get a new network number the next time you tether.
But it's also not consistent.

I've seen various suggestions of how to stop it but all the ones I've tried seem to work for a while and then stop working.
But see below.

You can remove the 'extra' networks and start again from '2' if you are happy using the registry editor.

Open regedit and find: Computer\HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles

Check each profile entry and delete any that say 'Network #' for the profile name.
I leave 'Network' itself alone, and all the others that may be there. (unless I recognise say an old wifi router that i'm never going to connect to again, but if in doubt leave it there).
Next time you tether you'll start again with 'Network 2'.

 

You could also try this, which seems to be working for me currently (For the last month or so):
Tether the phone/device using USB, then:
Open Device Manager > Network adapters and find "#### USB Remote NDIS Network Device"
Right click it and go to Properties > Advanced > Network Address.
Assign a value.
I assigned a value of 1 and my tethered phone comes up as 'Network 2' no matter how many times I disconnect/reconnect it. (for now).

 

 

Edited October 18, 2018 by nukecad

[nov1]

Many thanks, nukecad.

Much appreciated ??

[exile360]

It could also be due to the virtual network adapters that Windows creates (generally for things like network connection sharing with other systems and ad-hoc networks; feature no one actually uses, but Microsoft delusionally believes are important  ).  You can check this by  going to Control Panel\Network and Internet\Network Connections (should be accessible by going to Control Panel, clicking on Network and Internet, clicking Network and Sharing Center, then clicking Change adapter settings on the left; at least that's where it is in Windows 7) and taking a look at the network adapters listed there.  There should be one for every physical networking device in the system (i.e. wired, wireless/USB adapter etc.) and there may be one or multiple Microsoft Virtual adapters, each of which represents some function related to one or more of your networking devices and its capabilities for other types of connections (like peer-to-peer ad-hoc networks like using your personal wi-fi connection as an access point for other wireless devices to reach the internet and/or share files etc.).

[nov1]

Hi exile360,

This is my current set up:

 

When I first established my Ethernet connection it created the "Ethernet 3", and so I disabled the other two afterwards as I don't think they were needed turned on (especially the Wifi)

 

-Thank you

 

[nov1]

Is this all looking normal to you? ?

 

 

[exile360]

OK, yes, that looks normal.  What nukecad mentioned above regarding removable devices must be the issue, and it is a common occurrence with removable devices in Windows (most commonly seen with external storage devices like USB flash drives and external hard drives etc.) because Windows will often see the same device as a "new" device, assigning it a new/higher number whenever it is detached from the PC and re-attached afterwards (which occurs automatically when the system is shut down/rebooted).

[nov1]

Big thanks to the pair of you!  you have put my mind much more at rest ?

[exile360]

I'm glad we could help set your mind at ease

Windows definitely has its quirks, and this just happens to be one of them.  It's all about how they implement hot-swappable/removable devices and how the OS keeps track of them.  While one could argue that since each individual device has its own hardware IDs (beyond the more general ones used for identifying the model/manufacturer for drivers etc.; i.e. the ones that would be used for things like security and individual specific device identification for things like security keys for games and secured device access, similar to fingerprinting and password verification), Windows tends to handle such devices in a more generic manner, probably because it's just easier to implement and doesn't have much of a downside (other than the occasional oddity like this numbering issue you yourself have stumbled across) but since it doesn't really hinder the device's functionality, they haven't done anything to fix it.  I'm sure someday some programmer at Microsoft will figure out that it's kinda silly to keep writing new entries in the registry for the same device plugged into/removed from the same system multiple times and will do something to fix it, but as long as it isn't creating any actual problems I'm sure no one is terribly anxious to implement such a change/fix.

[nov1]

Hey exile360,  is 425mbps a decent speed for an Ethernet connection?

[exile360]

It all depends on the type of internet service you're connecting to.  In my case I'm using DSL, so 425mbps would be REALLY fast for me (I'm at around 6.8mbps which is megabits per-second/860KBps which is kilobytes per-second for my actual download speed, but Windows shows my connection as being 144.4Mbps since I'm on wi-fi (wireless N) to my modem/router).  For ethernet, it depends on whether it's a standard 100 connection or 1000 (gigabit ethernet); I'm guessing the latter, but either way, that number doesn't really represent the actual speed of your connection for accessing the web, just the potential maximum speed for the connection type that you're using to access it (i.e. the connection to your router/modem etc.).

If you want to test your actual internet bandwidth/connection speed you can use something like the speed test at Speakeasy.net or the one at Speedtest.net.  That will give you an idea of your "true" internet speed, and you can compare that to what your ISP (Internet Service Provider) promises (in my case, I'm actually getting MORE than what they promise thanks to the fact that I'm hooked up to a particularly fast node on their network which is just my good fortune as the fastest they offer in my area is actually limited to only 6mbps whereas in reality I'm getting closer to 7mbps (it used to be close to 8mbps, but it wasn't super stable so they sent out a tech to balance the line load and while it did slow things down a bit for downloads, it's now super reliable and my upstream/upload bandwidth has actually increased to 2x~3x what it was before so it's a decent trade-off).

Edited October 20, 2018 by exile360

[nov1]

Ohh, many thanks for the clarification.

I'll have to do a proper test ?

 

 

 

[nukecad]

I'm with Exile on the download speed.
The other evening I was downloading some videos from BBC iPlayer using my phones 3G+ (HSDPA) connection.
Theoretically 3G+ has a maximum of 42 Mbps, but you'll never get that outside of a lab.
I was getting  between 5 Mbps and 11 Mbps for the actual download speed.

And just to show the 'Windows buggeration factor'.
I've just tethered my phone and despite that tweak in the Device Manager I now have 'Network 3' again this time.

Oh well, it worked to keep it at Nework 2 for a month or so, which is better then getting a new one everyday.
Lets see how long it stays with Network 3, or if it starts climbing again.

[exile360]

Yeah, it's kinda silly that Microsoft hasn't done better with removable device identification yet.  Each chip/hardware plugged in has a specific serial number unique to that specific device that Windows can see, so it theoretically could identify when you've plugged in the exact same device vs an identical make/model from the same vendor and tell the difference without having to create it as a new device/connection every time, but they just don't.  It probably has something to do with the fact that most systems have multiple USB ports and it's possible to move a device from one port to another and they're playing it safe to avoid some kind of hardware/device conflict, but still, I would think they could come up with a more elegant solution than just increasing the number of the drive/device/connection constantly like this.

At least with removable drives you can assign a specific drive letter and write it to the autorun.inf file so that Windows (most versions at least) will assign the same drive letter to it every time (I typically use "X" for my portable drives) but with networking devices and dongles you don't have that option unfortunately.

Edited October 21, 2018 by exile360

[nukecad]

On 10/21/2018 at 2:11 PM, nukecad said:

And just to show the 'Windows buggeration factor'.
I've just tethered my phone and despite that tweak in the Device Manager I now have 'Network 3' again this time.

Oh well, it worked to keep it at Nework 2 for a month or so, which is better then getting a new one everyday.
Lets see how long it stays with Network 3, or if it starts climbing again.

Just to report 4 days on and it's still giving Network 3, I reckon I've plugged/unplugged/tethered the phone from the USB port about 20 times.

So that Device Manager tweak does seem to slow down the increasing Network numbers even if it doesn't stop it completely.
Although:
I'm not entirely sure here but I believe it may have been a Windows Defender definition update on Sunday that caused Windows to allocate a new network number at the next tethering.
I have 'Ethernet 2' (the USB port) set as a metered connection so updates are blocked when tethering. (And Sunday was the last time I was on an unmetered wifi network and got a Defender definition update).
I'll try to remember to keep an eye on it to see just what causes the renumbering. I'm doing a lot of tethering at the moment because I have lost wifi access at home.

[exile360]

That makes sense since, like Malwarebytes, Microsoft uses a WFP (Windows Filtering Platform) driver to hook into the network stack (though Defender uses it for a different purpose; primarily for scanning network traffic/packet inspection while Malwarebytes only does blacklist website filtering/connection blocking which is far more high level) and if you check Autoruns (and I believe the hidden devices in Device Manager as well) you'll find at least one Windows Defender driver listed there, usually with some long semi-random string from the last time it updated.

It's probably this driver removal/reinstallation through definition updates that is triggering it in your case, bypassing the tweak you performed (I'd like info on that tweak if you've got it handy by the way, as I could use it for similar issues).

[nukecad]

Can't remember now just where I got that tweak from.

I was looking for a solution to the increasing network numbers so had made a note of a few tweaks from different places. (Most didnt work).

If I find it again I'll post a link.

[nukecad]

Just to note that almost 3 weeks on I'm still getting "Network 3" despite tethering/untethering (and shutting down/rebooting) multiple times each day.

So that Device Manager tweak in post #2 does seem to be working, and it doesn't seem to be affected by Defender definition updates.
(One day I'll track down just what it is that occasionally overrides the tweak and gives a new network ).

Edited November 11, 2018 by nukecad

[nukecad]

And 3 weeks to the day it has now increased to 'Network 4'.

Interestingly I had already had a session starting at around 17:00 and lasting till 19:20 or so that was Network 3.
I hadn't done anything out of the ordinary, just my normal Sunday routine tasks.

I then shut down, had a meal etc., and rebooted/retethered at 21:25 which then gave me Network 4.

Interesting that it's exactly 3 weeks to the day, may be a clue as to what may be causing it?
I'll leave it alone to see if it's another 3 weeks to the next one.

[nukecad]

Mmm, it seems that following the patch Tuesday updates the counter is increasing again for every tethering, up to Network 6 now.
I guess the updates changed/reset something?

[exile360]

Well that's frustrating.  Hopefully you can figure out how to eliminate it once more.  Personally, I prevent it by disabling/removing all protocols from my network connections except the one which is essential for we connectivity:

I also disable sharing, remote connectivity and all that other stuff MS has built in/enabled by default since I don't use any of it, and removing/disabling it shrinks the attack surface to reduce the probability of being hacked remotely or through my network.

[nukecad]

After some more testing (playing) I have decided to my own satisfaction that it's Windows Defender Definition Updates that is increasing the Network number. (The next time you tether).

I had noticed that if I was only using the laptop tethered it did not increase, but if I then used it on wifi the next time I tethered I got a new network number.
At first I thought it may have been simply switching between wifi and tethering that caused it.
But then I realised that each time I used wifi it was an unmetered connection, and so Defender would update it's definitions automatically.
Of course when tethered the connection was metered, so no automatic updates.

I tested this by unplugging my tethered phone, replugging and retethering. This gave the same network number.
I then used 'Check for Updates' on my tethered, metered, connection and allowed a Defender Definition Update to download and install.
Unplugged the tethered phone again, replugged and retethered.
Bingo, a new network number.

So I'm fairly satisfied that it's a new tethering, following a Defender Definition Update, that causes the network number to increase.
No definition update, no increase.

The next question is just why a Defender Definition Update should cause Windows to see your device as 'new' the next time you connect it.

Edited December 3, 2018 by nukecad

[nukecad]

Zombie Post.  As the UK is in lockdown (again) I'm bored and looking back at old issues.

I never did solve this particular issue, but two years on now I'm using my computer a different way.

The 'increasing networks' issue for tethering a phone on windows 8.# or 10 happens if you Shutdown (or Restart) -  If you Hibernate (or Sleep) it doesn't happen.

Shutting Down with Windows 10 is not like it used to be on older Windows versions, (in particular with Win 10 "Restart" will clear more than shutting down will).

The Windows 10 OS is written in the expectation that a users computer is always running, or hibernated, or asleep, and never shut down.

Again, what we used to know about  Hibernate and/or Sleep work has changed, Windows 10 uses the same words but means/does different things to what older Windows versions did.

To get back to this thread.

I now Hibernate (occasionally sleep) rather than shutting down, and Windows 10 recognises the same network number from last time - no matter how many times I unplug/replug the tethered phone.

It will only increase the network number if there is a Restart or Shutdown.

[shottootto]

This workaround does it for me. See Nukecad  October 18 2018

Yes Windows 10 does it all the time when you tether a device via USB.

It's always on Ethernet2, but the Network number increases over time. (I've see posts from users with 'Network 150' or higher).
From my own use it seems to be after a shutdown you sometimes get a new network number the next time you tether.
But it's also not consistent.
I've seen various suggestions of how to stop it but all the ones I've tried seem to work for a while and then stop working.But see below.
You can remove the 'extra' networks and start again from '2' if you are happy using the registry editor.
Open regedit and find: Computer\HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles
Check each profile entry and delete any that say 'Network #' for the profile name.
I leave 'Network' itself alone, and all the others that may be there. (unless I recognise say an old wifi router that i'm never going to connect to again, but if in doubt leave it there).
Next time you tether you'll start again with 'Network 2'.

I managed to automate it as follows:

After following Nukecad’s instructions  go back  to
Computer\HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles and make sure “profiles” is selected
On top menu, click [FILE] and [EXPORT]. Type in a file name (“netprofiles” used here) and click save.
Go to that saved file, right click and select “EDIT”.

Insert 2 empty lines under “Windows Registry Editor Version x.xx”
Highlight [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsNT\CurrentVersion\
NetworkList\profiles] and paste it 2 lines up.
Now in the line just pasted, inset “-“ (minus) between “[“ and “HKEY”. This is what you should have now:

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[-HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles]

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles]

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\NetworkList\Profiles\{0781F5B1-28F7-4BE0-8E0C-DD76F2531F55}]
"ProfileName"="RANDCI"
"Description"="RANDCI"
"Managed"=dword:00000000
"Category"=dword:00000001
        ... and so on.

You can save the file on the desktop and execute it whenever you want to reset the network numbers.

I went a step further:

Saved the file to Windows directory.
Created text file in Windows directory and named it “winstart.bat”
Inside the file paste this line [regedit.exe /s netprofiles.reg] without the brackets
Create a shortcut for the bat file. Right click the shortcut and select copy.
Click [start] icon, then [all programs] and right click [startup] and select [open]
Paste the copied shortcut here.
Your registry update will be executed at windows start up.

Edited November 16, 2021 by AdvancedSetup
corrected font issue