Another Windows 7 x64 freeze after the 1.0.508 update

[Terryl]

OK kids, I just tried turning off the web protection trick and got this.....(see photo)

 

So now what is going on????? I need to get these computers back on-line ASAP as they are for cabinet design.

 

Do I have to disable MWB or revert back to the last working version?

[jasongillman]

Today's Microsoft update seems to have fixed the problem and I have been up for several hours without lock up and web protection ON.

 

 

[jasongillman]

 

I should note:

 

The updates today
1. Security Update for Microsoft windows (KB4480970)
2. Update for Microsoft Windows (KB4480063)

[exile360]

Odd, I was just finally able to replicate the system freeze on my own box.  After having Ransomware Protection enabled for several hours, it finally froze the system while I was watching Netflix through SRWare Iron (a Chromium based browser, though I doubt that's relevant).  Initially I could close programs except the browser which had become unresponsive, probably because it was the process being analyzed at the time by Ransomware Protection, though that's just my guess based on the behavior.  Anyway, the system froze and I ended up having to force a shutdown via the power button and upon restarting the system I quickly disabled Ransomware Protection to prevent further lockups.

My system is fully patched with Windows Updates, including those you mentioned above and when the freeze occurred those updates had already been installed for several hours prior to any trouble (I patched manually early yesterday via Windows Update as I always do every Patch Tuesday).

Edited January 9, 2019 by exile360

[LiquidTension]

4 hours ago, mkaz said:

Is there a technical reason why Malwarebytes never considered pushing clients back to the previous version that did not experience the freeze issue until troubleshooting and a solution is identified?  I can't imagine the troubleshooting and frustration that effected users are going through, especially those without the technical skills to know where to begin, what to test, and where to look for help.  Until a toggle or turning off Malwarebytes completely is performed, Malwarebytes may be one of the last things that your clients are looking at.    I appreciate the consistent communication from Malwarebytes now in the forum.  Thank you.

Hi mkaz,

The update (components package 1.0.508) that this issue is exhibited with contains fixes for several critical issues that affect the majority of the Malwarebytes user base. Furthermore, our telemetry shows that only a small amount of the user base are actively being impacted by this freeze issue.

Rest assured, we have a significant number of resources working hard to resolve this issue. We appreciate everyone's feedback and understanding.

[LiquidTension]

2 hours ago, robhab said:

I have used Malwarebytes non-premium version for many years and I greatly appreciate the various anti-malware resources that MB has provided for free.   Thank you MB.  The cost of the premium version is trivial when you consider the value. 

However, my time and piece-of-mind is not trivial.  I only happened to discover the freeze conflict with Malwarebytes Premium by chance, and it still took me a couple of days to confirm after searching the web and some trial-and-error.  The holiday period actually helped because I had some free time to investigate.  Luckily, the problem was obvious and simple to uncover, which has not been the case in the past.  Like several other posters, I was just about to go down some software and hardware rabbit holes that would have been unnecessary and painful, but stopped short mostly due to the forums, which were crucial in this case.  Doctors promise to "first do no harm."   This should apply to MS updates and anti-malware as well.  

This has got to be an awful problem to fix.  I am skeptical but hopeful that MB will eventually fix it.   Good luck.

We do apologise for this issue. We're working hard to track down the cause and provide a permanent solution. Thank you for your understanding.

[LAVA]

On 1/8/2019 at 8:01 AM, LiquidTension said:

We're looking for volunteers to assist with the troubleshooting of this issue by performing Kernel-Mode debugging on the affected machine. This is quite an in-depth process that has a few specific prerequisites. If anyone is interested, please let me know and I'll send you a message with the details. 

Thank you!

Okay, it's been a few days, but I want to follow-up:

I have been methodically reinstalling the OS, software, and updates while observing the behavior with MBAM 3.6.1.2711 CP 1.0.508  and saving restore points as I go.  Same hardware & drivers as before, except Windows 7.1 Ultimate instead of Enterprise.   I'm down to the last main software package: Adobe CC 2018 (tedious install) and then a few utilities like 7zip, etc.

So far, no freezes or hangs.  I know MBAM engineers are focusing on a network adapter/driver issue, and that is a possibilty.  However, when my system was freezing (on the prior OS installation), I was able to access 'administrative shares' ( e.g. \\machine\C$ ) and ping the adapter on several occasions. 

I did come across a KB patch/article in which MS mentioned certain network drivers being bricked by the patch.  Unfortunately, it was 2-3 a.m. and I was too sleep deprived to note the KB#.

So, the remaining possiblities I've isolated in my case are:

FireFox (Quantum) version 60 thru 62.x.x.x   Mozilla has since updated FFQ to 64.0, so I can't retest.
Chrome browser
Adobe CC (specifically Adobe services which update, launch, or authenticate Acrobat and CC apps)
Nvidia driver 242.00

Other than the above, it might be an obscure OS patch or a specific combination of drivers/patches.

I won't be able to debug with this machine (Dell T3610) because it needs to be put into production asap... I'm over a week behind.

However, if my upcoming installation (Dell T5610) starts freezing, I'll let you know.  😉

[LiquidTension]

2 hours ago, Terryl said:

OK kids, I just tried turning off the web protection trick and got this.....(see photo)

So now what is going on????? I need to get these computers back on-line ASAP as they are for cabinet design.

Do I have to disable MWB or revert back to the last working version?

Please could you run the Malwarebytes Support Tool and provide the file generated. Instructions here:
https://forums.malwarebytes.com/topic/190532-having-problems-using-malwarebytes-please-follow-these-steps/

This will help us better understand what caused the issue.

If you're looking for a quick fix, I recommend the second option listed under known workarounds.
https://forums.malwarebytes.com/topic/241223-malwarebytes-for-windows-and-windows-7-freezelock-up/

[Telliege]

1 hour ago, exile360 said:

Odd, I was just finally able to replicate the system freeze on my own box.  After having Ransomware Protection enabled for several hours, it finally froze the system while I was watching Netflix through SRWare Iron (a Chromium based browser, though I doubt that's relevant).  Initially I could close programs except the browser which had become unresponsive, probably because it was the process being analyzed at the time by Ransomware Protection, though that's just my guess based on the behavior.  Anyway, the system froze and I ended up having to force a shutdown via the power button and upon restarting the system I quickly disabled Ransomware Protection to prevent further lockups.

My system is fully patched with Windows Updates, including those you mentioned above and when the freeze occurred those updates had already been installed for several hours prior to any trouble (I patched manually early yesterday via Windows Update as I always do every Patch Tuesday).

I honestly don't think it is an windows update related issue. (Wow, never thought id say those words :P) I originally went that route even checked for the update that was later announced to check. Some of my clients had it and had the issue. Some of my clients that did not have the patch had the issue. Its all over the place with hardware & drivers as well. I am almost beginning to think that this bug manifest over time with some bug with networking & combination of web browsers themselves. Seems computer idle for long period or sudden hard use from idle crashes it.

[MajesticWi]

7 minutes ago, LiquidTension said:

We do apologise for this issue. We're working hard to track down the cause and provide a permanent solution. Thank you for your understanding.

I don't know if this is related, but I have been doing some experimenting on my own.  Since the hard freeze never occurs for me right after boot up or for a period of time after boot up, I decided to play around with some of the Malwarebyte settings that interact with Windows 7 during my time on the computer.  With Malwarebytes set for FULL protection I have found that if I disable Malwarebytes' Automatically Check for Updates setting and do the updates manually the freeze problem is gone.  So far my testing has been only for 2 days, but prior to this I was experiencing at least one freeze once a day.

Ironically I read today an earlier post about " Security Update for Microsoft windows (KB4480970)" possibly resolving the issue.   Since I had that security update installed on Patch Tuesday, I re-enabled the Auto Update setting and the computer hard froze with-in a couple of hours.  I have since disabled the Auto Update feature and will see if my desktop remains freeze free.

I don't know if the 1.0.508 update contained enhancements for updating Malwarebytes, but I thought I would mention it.

Thanks LiquidTension for your assistance !

[rogerwinters]

I have been having issues on multiple PC's running Windows 7 since Dec 15, 2018; hard lockups where everything just stops, usb ports dead, disk activity dead, etc and no other option except to do a hard reset.  I've done troubleshooting with msconfig; disabling services and startup programs.  Right now PC is fairly stable although when I tried to apply Divx update everything locked up again.  I only came across this thread today and haven't yet tried any of the workarounds.

mbst-grab-results.zip

[mkaz]

24 minutes ago, LAVA said:

I have been methodically reinstalling the OS, software, and updates while observing the behavior with MBAM 3.6.1.2711 CP 1.0.508  and saving restore points as I go.  Same hardware & drivers as before, except Windows 7.1 Ultimate instead of Enterprise.   I'm down to the last main software package: Adobe CC 2018 (tedious install) and then a few utilities like 7zip, etc.

So far, no freezes or hangs. 😉

@Lava, curious whether your OS updates include the new Jan. updates now coming out.....  Today, @JasonGillman posted:

Today's Microsoft update seems to have fixed the problem and I have been up for several hours without lock up and web protection ON.

[mkaz]

1 hour ago, LiquidTension said:

Furthermore, our telemetry shows that only a small amount of the user base are actively being impacted by this freeze issue.

I have no doubt that you and the rest of the staff are working this issue hard.  But I do have to ask how your telemetry will pick up users with freezes in this scenario:

1. User A has freeze issues and uses Malwarebytes
2. User A does not know how to troubleshoot this
3. User A does not know the impact from Malwarebytes (or other interaction)
4. User A has not input a ticket with Malwarebytes for the issue because he has not troubleshot this down to Malwarebytes yet nor found or visited the forum
5. User A has performed force shutdowns numerous times
6. User B is part of a company whose IT staff adjusted or removed Malwarebytes and did not communicate this to your company.  Freezes and force shutdowns led up to this decision.
7. There are plenty more scenarios of this kind that one can think of

You telemetry picks up all the force shutdowns around the world???

[LAVA]

23 minutes ago, mkaz said:

@Lava, curious whether your OS updates include the new Jan. updates now coming out.....  Today, @JasonGillman posted:

Today's Microsoft update seems to have fixed the problem and I have been up for several hours without lock up and web protection ON.

Nope... most of my patch #'s stop at around KB 315xxxx.    I have one patch from 2017:  KB4019990. 

Otherwise the patching is over a year out of date, as was the prior system configuration which had been freezing... I'm trying to replicate the problem as I rebuild the system.

[abs7125]

17 minutes ago, mkaz said:

I have no doubt that you and the rest of the staff are working this issue hard.  But I do have to ask how your telemetry will pick up users with freezes in this scenario:

1. User A has freeze issues and uses Malwarebytes
2. User A does not know how to troubleshoot this
3. User A does not know the impact from Malwarebytes (or other interaction)
4. User A has not input a ticket with Malwarebytes for the issue because he has not troubleshot this down to Malwarebytes yet nor found or visited the forum
5. User A has performed force shutdowns numerous times
6. User B is part of a company whose IT staff adjusted or removed Malwarebytes and did not communicate this to your company.  Freezes and force shutdowns led up to this decision.
7. There are plenty more scenarios of this kind that one can think of

You telemetry picks up all the force shutdowns around the world???

I have to agree, with this user. Your statement of only a few users being affected, due to your "telemetry results", is poor.  It took me a couple days, of troubleshooting, before I was able to find out you guys where the cause. Based on all the responses just from THIS form, I would say its a more serious problem, then your admitting to. I am sure there are many users, who have no idea, their system issues, are because of Maleware. You guys need to do a better job, owning up to the fact, you caused software damage, to ALLOT of users.

[LAVA]

To MBAM staff, et-al:

Saw this post over on TenForums.com   Identical to symptoms when I began troubleshooting freezes on a Dell T3610... including speaker anomaly.

https://www.tenforums.com/performance-maintenance/123256-random-freeze-preceeded-sudden-speaker-static.html

[arbrich]

Just had 3 more customers tell me that they have been freezing intermittently but did not think much about it until it repeated a few times which they let em know today.

There are a lot more people out there having these issues then you think. They are just not reporting it here yet. 

I am actively rolling everyone reporting lock ups back to CU 1.0.482.

Thanks for your continued support on this.

[LAVA]

1 hour ago, abs7125 said:

I have to agree, with this user. Your statement of only a few users being affected, due to your "telemetry results", is poor.  It took me a couple days, of troubleshooting, before I was able to find out you guys where the cause. Based on all the responses just from THIS form, I would say its a more serious problem, then your admitting to. I am sure there are many users, who have no idea, their system issues, are because of Maleware. You guys need to do a better job, owning up to the fact, you caused software damage, to ALLOT of users.

Indeed. That's one of the reasons I pasted a link to the comment/post over at TenForums.com  (with identical symptoms).

How many users think the freeze is due to Windows 10, MS, etc... and never consider MBAM, let alone contact MB?

This is not to say MBAM is the sole source of the problem, since MS creates a 'moving target' every month...

 

[mightaswell]

@LAVA Component Update 3.6.1 v1.0.508 was released on December 7th. The Tensforums article you linked described issues back in November before the offending CU update had been released to the general public so would appear to be unrelated. 

However I agree with @abs7125  and @mkaz that it does appear likely to be more widespread than they could know. When a computer freezes and needs a hard reboot or is simply powered off normally how is that sort of data differentiated? 

[Jagdpanther]

Having the described problem.

Only discovered Malwarebytes was the cause after going into MSCONFIG and disabling all the non-microsoft services and then switching them on/off one by one and waiting to see if it happened and then stumbling upon the article on BleepingComputer.

 

Rolled back my Malwarebytes to Component package 1.0.482 and attached the needed files in the zip.

mbst-grab-results.zip

[GK2005]

Adding in my two cents as well:

I also suspect that this is a much more prevalent issue than what is being reported - just simply most users experiencing this issue haven't figured out (yet) that it's malwarebytes causing the issue. Speaking from personal experience, I had 1 system that's been locking up intermittently since around December 13th, and the 2nd system just started locking up about a week ago. Both sets of hardware are pretty near polar opposites of one another.

It's taken me all this time to figure out that it was malwarebytes in both cases. The 1st system - has completely been through the ringer (tested all of the hardware from the power supply all the way to the motherboard; also found corrupted windows files that could not be repaired - so it's a clean install). The 2nd system - I thought it was windows registry issues - so to has a clean install.

Long story short - I'm baffled by what's causing the issue, but using the trick of disabling web &/or ransomware protection has resulted in zero lockups.

[Skullomania]

I've also had the hanging at boot since December. Computer would also totally freeze during scanning requiring a hard reset. I turned it (MB) off at boot and the problems went away. The only other 2 things loading at boot outside Windows were Avast and Colour Munki software.

Windows 7 x64.

 

[exile360]

1 hour ago, Skullomania said:

I've also had the hanging at boot since December. Computer would also totally freeze during scanning requiring a hard reset. I turned it (MB) off at boot and the problems went away. The only other 2 things loading at boot outside Windows were Avast and Colour Munki software.

Windows 7 x64.

 

I do believe there's an issue with Avast's Web Protection conflicting with the Web Protection in the latest build of Malwarebytes 3 so it's possible that if you disable the web shield in Avast or the Web Protection in Malwarebytes that you'd be able to eliminate the issue until it is fixed.

[tend2it]

I've been troubleshooting this issue since Dec on my son's z800 workstation.  Random freezing/crashes and more frequent ones of late especially when running battle.net to update Overwatch (which resulted in an instant repeatable freeze).  Was worried I had some hardware failing with no clue on what it may be.  Since MB had that infamous Jan 2018 system killer update, any system related crashes put MB on the possible cause radar.   As soon as I clean uninstalled MB, the freezes went away.  Forced to do Hard Resets is not good for the HDD.

After much googling, I found a topic that pointed back to MB, which brought me here.  Currently, I rolled back MB per Workaround #2 on the official issue announcement, 

Attached are the requested files.  It appears to be isolated to this particular system hardware.  My other Win7 Home system hasn't exhibited any symptoms that I know of.

Hope this gets resolved soon.

mbst-grab-results.zip

[COBKA]

5 hours ago, exile360 said:

I do believe there's an issue with Avast's Web Protection conflicting with the Web Protection in the latest build of Malwarebytes 3 so it's possible that if you disable the web shield in Avast or the Web Protection in Malwarebytes that you'd be able to eliminate the issue until it is fixed.

I also have that belief. I can't remember the exact timing but my system wouldn't load Chrome one day and it was because the Avast Web Shield had crashed and wouldn't reload. I had to uninstall it to get Chrome working again. I believe this happened around the time I started to get freezing. As I mentioned earlier in this thread Avast Free version 19.1.2360 was released a week or so ago and I am hopeful it is more compatible.