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MBAM 3.0.6 and Office 2016 with Win10 Creator's Update


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This discussion does nothing to make us feel MWB understand the impact of this problem.  

MWB may not have heard from most people affected by this problem, because ... 

One installs the Creator update, apparently all OK, then one works on an office file, tries to do a Save As, it freezes.  No clues as to why.   Much head scratching, investigation, complete frustration, etc.  Perhaps possibly backing out the Creator update and blaming Microsoft.    This is a nasty problem that appears in well trusted applications.

But only a minority of those affected will accidentally stumble across a clue that the problem lies with Malwarebytes.

The response from MWB is casual in the extreme.  No apology.  No sense that they appreciate the wide impact, no sense of  urgency. 

It is well past the time for MWB to get a grip on this problem. 

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David, I can assure you we are giving this issue top priority.There are a couple of other big moving parts with the impending release of 3.1 which includes this fix and is almost code complete. As soon as we have the build we will post it here and release an automatic Component Update to the entire user base.

Sorry for the problem this has caused all of you. It was triggered due to an unforeseen last minute change in the Win10 Creators Update. We have been in communication with Microsoft since the first time this was reported and are working with them on a daily basis to deploy the fix asap.

 

 

Edited by pbust
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HI PBUST - just a suggestion, but of the 2 tier one and 1 tier 2 techs I worked with at Microsoft Support, NOBODY knew about this.  

I was actually the one who figured it out after about 4 hours on the phone with them when I realized that I had just updated MBAM in the couple of days.  

As part of your communication with MS since this was first reported, so far they haven't informed their techs about the problem.  You might suggest that they put this in their knowledgebase and alert their team about it, as the problem manifests as a Word, Excel, Outlook Mail Merge or other MS Office product problem, and for me, i got lucky 4 hours later and went to MBAM.  

Love the product. First massive glitch for me with you guys, but it's a doozy....  

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3 hours ago, AdvancedSetup said:

Hello @Davidhs

And thank you for your feedback. It was Microsoft that made the change that caused this issue, not us. We are actively working on fixing this and hope to have a released fix for this in the next couple of weeks.

Thank you for your patience.

Ron

 

M$ may have issued the Windows update that conflicted with MBAM leading to a critical problem with Word/Office, but MB has known for over two weeks about it, and has neither issued an emergency fix nor made a reasonable effort to alert users about the work-around.

"The next couple of weeks" translates to thousands of users encountering headaches, frustration, lost work, and possibly more.  If the perma-fix is not do-able for some time, a mass alert is absolutely essential.

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I've been monitoring this thread with quite some interest... I am amazed how someone can install MANUALLY a pre-release version of software and then suddenly complain that they have "issues", duh, of course you do. If your business depends on your computers it is irresponsible to install pre-release software on them. The early and manual release of Windows 10 Creators edition was done specifically to detect and find issues - i.e. YOU ARE A BETA TESTER.

Responsible business IT would NEVER install this on production machines - they wouldn't even allow it to roll out thru Windows Update until they had thoroughly tested it - period.
It is great you are discovering issues with this upgrade so those who are responsible can take advantage of the fixes you generate - which is why they released it manually early in the first place. If you are in a dire predicament because of your choices - that is on you - you should know better.

The official stance at Microsoft is you SHOULD NOT INSTALL THE CREATORS EDITION MANUALLY, you should wait till the rollout thru windows update (http://forums.iobit.com/forum/driver-booster/driver-booster-v4/220131-microsoft-recommends-that-users-do-not-manually-install-windows-10-creators-update-temporarily).

I appreciate the reporting of errors with Microsoft's latest version - but complaining that your business is hurting because of it, just shows the lack of true IT competence. The posts on what level of priority Malware Bytes should put on this problem is a bit pre-mature and disparages the fine programmers without cause.

 

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4 hours ago, Zxel said:

I've been monitoring this thread with quite some interest... I am amazed how someone can install MANUALLY a pre-release version of software and then suddenly complain that they have "issues", duh, of course you do. If your business depends on your computers it is irresponsible to install pre-release software on them. The early and manual release of Windows 10 Creators edition was done specifically to detect and find issues - i.e. YOU ARE A BETA TESTER.

Responsible business IT would NEVER install this on production machines - they wouldn't even allow it to roll out thru Windows Update until they had thoroughly tested it - period.
It is great you are discovering issues with this upgrade so those who are responsible can take advantage of the fixes you generate - which is why they released it manually early in the first place. If you are in a dire predicament because of your choices - that is on you - you should know better.

The official stance at Microsoft is you SHOULD NOT INSTALL THE CREATORS EDITION MANUALLY, you should wait till the rollout thru windows update (http://forums.iobit.com/forum/driver-booster/driver-booster-v4/220131-microsoft-recommends-that-users-do-not-manually-install-windows-10-creators-update-temporarily).

I appreciate the reporting of errors with Microsoft's latest version - but complaining that your business is hurting because of it, just shows the lack of true IT competence. The posts on what level of priority Malware Bytes should put on this problem is a bit pre-mature and disparages the fine programmers without cause.

 

#1) I'm not a business.

#2) this is the current CU product page, as of one minute ago: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/features - "Windows 10 keeps getting better - the Creators Update includes new innovations, features and security capabilities. To ensure the best experience the update rolls out via auto-updates when your PC is ready. Or if you want to get the update now, download the Update Assistant."  The Update Assistant said my "PC [was] ready," so I installed it.  It is NOT "pre-release," nor "beta.".

#3) Yes, Microsoft holds blame here.  But the fact remains, MB has known for over two weeks that MBAM doesn't play nice with CU, to the point of crippling a very important application.

Your post is the classic "blame the victim."  So far, I've encountered two problems with CU: the MBAM problem, and a wonky WiFi card.  The MBAM problem took me two hours to figure out.  The WiFi card problem?  Two MINUTES, by simply updating the Intel driver.  The WiFi problem - a hardware compatibility problem - is the main reason Microsoft quickly issued the press release to not install CU manually.

Edited by norcalnative707x
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3 hours ago, Zxel said:

I am amazed how someone can install MANUALLY a pre-release version of software and then suddenly complain that they have "issues"

Who is thought to have installed what manually?   Not I.  Creator appeared at MS's pleasure and i let it install, as with the current version of MWB.

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31 minutes ago, Davidhs said:

Who is thought to have installed what manually?   Not I.  Creator appeared at MS's pleasure and i let it install, as with the current version of MWB.

As stated - no business IT I've ever seen would allow an update like this to install on their systems (even thru windows update) without first testing it in a sandbox environment - this has been the industry standard for as long as I can remember.

1 hour ago, norcalnative707x said:

#1) I'm not a business.

#2) this is the current CU product page, as of one minute ago: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/features - "Windows 10 keeps getting better - the Creators Update includes new innovations, features and security capabilities. To ensure the best experience the update rolls out via auto-updates when your PC is ready. Or if you want to get the update now, download the Update Assistant."  The Update Assistant said my "PC [was] ready," so I installed it.  It is NOT "pre-release," nor "beta.".

#3) Yes, Microsoft holds blame here.  But the fact remains, MB has known for over two weeks that MBAM doesn't play nice with CU, to the point of crippling a very important application.

Your post is the classic "blame the victim."  So far, I've encountered two problems with CU: the MBAM problem, and a wonky WiFi card.  The MBAM problem took me two hours to figure out.  The WiFi card problem?  Two MINUTES, by simply updating the Intel driver.  The WiFi problem - a hardware compatibility problem - is the main reason Microsoft quickly issued the press release to not install CU manually.

1. Then you should know what to expect, if not learn.

2. Did you even read the link I posted - the OFFICIAL Microsft statement, if you got sucked into their advertising then go flame them - issues such as these are common on new OS rollouts.

3.MB may have even known longer than two weeks - are you now a computer software expert - one that understands the impact of even a small change in software being relied on by a large user base? I don't think so! It is no small feat to make changes to a widely distributed piece of software, your lack of patience is no reason to rush anything (especially a program like this) out the door.

The only blame here is your ignorance and lack of patience - learn and get smarter - crying will just get you a crib. You think you're the first and only person who has spent many hours tracking down issues with their computer? If you're gonna play on the leading edge you better learn how to bleed with style - or get out of the game.

:P

Edited by Zxel
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3 hours ago, Zxel said:

 

1. Then you should know what to expect, if not learn.

As I noted, I have encountered exactly TWO problems, one corrected in two minutes with a driver update.

The other problem was something known by a software vendor, yet no attempt was made to actively outreach to those who would be affected by it.

 

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2. Did you even read the link I posted - the OFFICIAL Microsft statement, if you got sucked into their advertising then go flame them - issues such as these are common on new OS rollouts.

The IObit forum is not an "official Microsoft statement."

Microsoft's statement - released AFTER I had installed CU - addresses the fact that some users experience trouble with HARDWARE.  As I noted, that HARDWARE problem was easily corrected by an intuitive driver update.

Here's the actual M$ statement: https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2017/04/25/windows-10-creators-update-rollout-first-phase-update/#qFiM7AGHoQK0P6gL.97

Manual update is recommended against, but not prohibited.  Only in the case of known-serious hardware issues is manual update prohibited.  Many users will not see this post - it's not noted on the product page I posted earlier, and you can whine all you like about trusting marketing.  Optimum user experience is my priority - it may not be yours - and it's not Microsoft's, either.  Proactive solutions are far better than reactive ones.  The sorry state of affairs in computing, especially for end-users, is because of poor attitudes.

 

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3.MB may have even known longer than two weeks - are you now a computer software expert - one that understands the impact of even a small change in software being relied on by a large user base? I don't think so! It is no small feat to make changes to a widely distributed piece of software, your lack of patience is no reason to rush anything (especially a program like this) out the door.

It is unconscionable to simply sit on knowledge of a major problem.  Period, end of story.  The fix can't be released for weeks?  Fine.  The workaround is easy enough, but the cause is so bizarre it takes hours to ferret out the problem.

 

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The only blame here is your ignorance and lack of patience - learn and get smarter - crying will just get you a crib. You think you're the first and only person who has spent many hours tracking down issues with their computer? If you're gonna play on the leading edge you better learn how to bleed with style - or get out of the game.

You sure make lots of ASSumptions about people.  I'm not "crying" about my experience. I am highly concerned about the fact thousands more people will receive CU, either manually or automatically, before the MBAM fix is issued.  I know you don't give a sh*t, but I do.

Who are you a proxy for?

Edited by norcalnative707x
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Let's try to keep civil here please. I understand that many people are frustrated, but we are working to resolve the issue. Even when using beta software, we obviously want people to have the best experience possible with not only our software, but their entire computer. We will follow up when we have more information

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1 hour ago, norcalnative707x said:

The IObit forum is not an "official Microsoft statement."

You are correct, I had several tabs open (iobit was just one of them in my researching), and I obviously copied the wrong tab uri. Here is the correct one : https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2017/04/25/windows-10-creators-update-rollout-first-phase-update/#XTOKIUceoLkb6FU6.97 - I do believe that link is in their post though. There are other ones (especially if you have an MSDN developers account), but those are expensive.

Issues on new OS rollouts go back to the first versions ever released - they are the norm. You are on the "bleeding edge" if you install the Microsoft Creators "update", and that is what you should realize. Soooo, if you're going to be a first adopter be prepared for the consequences - stop whining about your problems - just report the issues you find and move along. Software developers don't need you screaming insults at them - they are aware of what their job is. :D

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My objection is that I was not able to find any reference to Malwarebytes and Word 2016 problems in my first four tries searching with Google.  This was over three days with various wording.  I didn't include Malwarebytes in my searches because I didn't know it was involved.

If Malwarebytes had posted an announcement of the problem, I could have found it and uninstalled Malwarebytes until a fix was available.  Instead, I lost some data and wasted several hours of time being frustrated and annoyed.

Windows 10 Creator was installed on my computer automatically by Windows update and not through any effort on my part to get it early.

The only problem I've had with Creator is with Word and Malwarebytes, and that was because there was no announcement that I could find to identify the problem until I stumbled on a message explaining that the source was Malwarebytes on a Windows Secrets forum.  The person posting the problem and solution did not know that Malwarebytes knew about the problem, so apparently he couldn't find that either.

I love Malwarebytes and have great respect for their programmers. However, management should post information about their product that will help their users even if the problem was caused by another company.  That's real customer service and generates product satisfaction.  Staying quiet because "it's not our fault" only makes your customers distrust you and your product.

Edited by jmk94903
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This is an outrageous situation in wasted manpower, hours, and downtime. The reflexive and completely uninformed Malwarebytes troll/fan boys in here contribute absolutely nothing to the discussion because they honestly don't have the first clue about what they are talking about. Their self-appointed role seems to be excusing this mess and waste everyone's time blaming 'n shaming customers as if this is somehow their fault. To this date, Malwarebytes has still kept this VERY SERIOUS bug hush-hush except in this forum. That is unacceptable, not defendable, and frankly seriously damages Malwarebytes' reputation going forward.

The "Creator's" update for Windows 10 is not beta-level code and is now arriving on computers through Microsoft Update, and once it arrives on a home or business network, it quickly finds its way to all of the other computers on that same network. No machine in this office is configured for beta-level updates. In fact, every update is reviewed manually before it is allowed on any machine here. When a major Windows update like this does arrive, it is test-run on computers before it gets out to all of them. That is how we FINALLY figured out where the problem was coming from: Malwarebytes, the only variable that explained the bug.

I don't personally have a problem with a company that unleashes a bug and then takes very visible responsibility and gives prominent attention to the problem and works lightning fast to resolve it. I am distressed to learn I discovered this thread purely by accident and my idea of emergency high priority attention and that of Malwarebytes seems to be several days apart.

Fix it or at least post it on your homepage and get the word out.

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I am not an expert by any means, but I agree with the comments indicating disappointment with the company for not disclosing proactively this issue. I have had problems with Microsoft Office programs since upgrading to Malwarebytes 3, but it really caused problems last night when I almost lost all my edits on a document and today when I tried to use Save As. Fortunately, I found my way to a Microsoft Office forum that pointed me to this forum. I have done the workaround, but I would like to know when the problem is resolved so that this gap in protection can be closed. Thanks to dcollins for being so forthright about the known issue and the workaround. 

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Wow! After posting the issue I had after spending a couple hours myself figuring out what the culprit was, I can't believe all the feedback my post has received, especially all the negative ones! I was pretty impressed at @dcollins quick response after my post, stating what the issue was and what the temporary work around is to fix the issue until the next release of MBAM 3 is... released! Yes, he knew the issue was with Anti-Exploit which has been addressed with the standalone MBAM Anti-Exploit. Why did his team not send out mass emails stating this issue and work around in MBAM? Who knows... maybe they just don't have an email blast setup to mass email consumers every time an issue arises. Even so, how many people would actually open and READ the email, not knowing the issue was caused by MBAM? Not many, leaving the message sitting in the inbox unread or even... deleted! 

Being a computer technician with my own business, my purpose of posting this issue was so I can inform the MBAM team what was going on, as well as help others who may have or are starting to come across this issue with the Creator's Update. According to MS themselves (and Ron Lewis, the manager of this forum).... it was caused by Microsoft themselves and not MBAM because of a last minute change to the CU before it was pushed out. 

On the 21st of April, MS posted a support article on their site, which links to this post,  stating it being a "known compatibility issue as reported also in Malwarebytes forum, and our engineering team is continuing to investigate."

https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Office-crashes-or-hangs-in-Windows-10-Creators-Update-with-Malwarebytes-3-0-7a59dfbc-5997-4798-903e-a9e709f17692

So, now MBAM, Microsoft knows, and, the others who are in my line of work and the consumers who know how to do a basic "Google" search... will know as well. 

A simple search of "malwarebytes issues with office" brings up the Office support article as the 4th site right on the first page! 

As for consumers, sure... they may not even figure this out on their own for a while unless they phone a friend or a call a tech but... if they follow the basic rules of computer troubleshooting... process of elimination.... they would eventually disable the programs running the in background.. such as... anti-virus and... malware protection! 

As for the Creator's Update, just like everything Microsoft pushes out, even after extensive beta testing, it was pushed with some bugs and Microsoft has been urging users to NOT force the update but... let it arrive in the updates when it's ready to do so.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/04/26/stop_downloading_win10_creators_update/

The MBAM team said an update will be released soon, within a week or less now.... for the people who are constantly bitching and complaining because they are taking forever and a day! Here's a question for you, would you rather them release a "quick fix" to fix this issue or release a more "robust fix" to fix this and other underlining issues MBAM may have since.... not only the Creator's Update but... other Windows updates after the Creator's Update was released? Have some damn patience! You aren't the boss of MBAM nor are you their higher-up stockholders so stop constantly trying to force them to send out a quick fix as they are continuing to work on the issue at hand with their team and Microsoft.... so they can then TEST it BEFORE it gets released to the masses! You don't know the complexity of the code for malware products so it would be best to sit back and relax until a release is out instead of acting like a 6 year old whining at your mother... "Can I have a cookie yet? How 'bout now? But I want it now, ma! Now! I can't wait!" 

It's nice to see some of you are being patient and appreciate the feedback of MBAM. Unfortunately, there always has be those who ruin it... 

I've installed MBAM on 23 computers (24 including mine) so far, after recommending it more to my customers this year and, to this date, haven't had any customers call to complain except for once back when the Web Protection was randomly not starting up... which has been fixed a while back. This has increased my revenue and has given me a constant revenue stream for my business. My customers are happier knowing they are safe from the constant threats they face every day in the online world. 

I'm not a damn suck up but I greatly appreciate the help and support the MBAM team has given me when I needed it which is hard to say for... most of the other software companies out there.. who usually want to charge for their support or remote in to try to fix it themselves...only to make matters worse (Yes, you hear me, Microsoft and Norton?)

Patience.... is a virtue.... you either have it or you don't.

Justin 

Edited by Dragontech
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Thanks, @Zxel! That means a lot! Most of us are in here to help others as much as we can, trying to keep it professional in the process. There are always going to be the unfortunate few who are going to bitch and whine because all of a sudden their wheel fell off their toy car and they don't know why it happened but they want it fixed and they want it fixed NOW! The temporary fix of gluing the wheel on until it's fixed for good... just isn't what they want to here... so they will just continue to bitch and moan.

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2 hours ago, Dragontech said:

Even so, how many people would actually open and READ the email, not knowing the issue was caused by MBAM? Not many, leaving the message sitting in the inbox unread or even... deleted! 

I would.  And does it matter how many would ignore it?

 

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So, now MBAM, Microsoft knows, and, the others who are in my line of work and the consumers who know how to do a basic "Google" search... will know as well. 

A simple search of "malwarebytes issues with office" brings up the Office support article as the 4th site right on the first page! 

You assume that those who encounter the problem know it's MBAM causing the problem, when in fact there is no intuitiveness to that.  MBAM refusing to allow Word to save?  Why, it's so obvious, right?

 

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As for consumers, sure... they may not even figure this out on their own for a while unless they phone a friend or a call a tech but... if they follow the basic rules of computer troubleshooting... process of elimination.... they would eventually disable the programs running the in background.. such as... anti-virus and... malware protection! 

Yes, it's just so easy for you (or me), but that's not the point.  It can take hours to figure out, in the blind, especially for those less adept.

The point is, wasted effort, when the temporary fix is so easy.

 

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As for the Creator's Update, just like everything Microsoft pushes out, even after extensive beta testing, it was pushed with some bugs and Microsoft has been urging users to NOT force the update but... let it arrive in the updates when it's ready to do so.

Much is being made about the "don't manually install" recommendation, but the fact of the matter is this: the MBAM/Word-Office problem can occur just as easily on the first phase hardware (e.g., Surfaces) that's it's being pushed out to.  And yes, it's being pushed out...there is no suspension of the roll-out, except to systems with known hardware issues.

 

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Here's a question for you, would you rather them release a "quick fix" to fix this issue or release a more "robust fix" to fix this and other underlining issues MBAM may have since.... not only the Creator's Update but... other Windows updates after the Creator's Update was released.

I would like knowledge of the temporary fix disseminated far and wide.  That hasn't happened.  The perma-fix can arrive as it can.

 

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Have some damn patience!

If only you had to say that face-to-face to any of the users frustrated to no end with the problem, working blindly to solve it.  Especially in the middle of something time-critical.

 

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You aren't the boss of MBAM nor are you their higher-up stockholders so

 

Oh, wow. 

No, we're just subscribing customers, who cares about those people...

(I don't believe MB staff believes this, only you)

 

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"Can I have a cookie yet? How 'bout now? But I want it now, ma! Now! I can't wait!"...Patience.... is a virtue.... you either have it or you don't.

Can we pay you in four weeks, when it's due yesterday?  Have some patience!

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by norcalnative707x
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1 hour ago, Dragontech said:

Thanks, @Zxel! That means a lot! ...trying to keep it professional in the process....the unfortunate few who are going to bitch and whine because all of a sudden their wheel fell off their toy car...they will just continue to bitch and moan.

LOL, "professional."

Curious that the two self-proclaimed "professionals" are who injected the crude insults into this thread.

When I help people solve their computer problems, I never make them feel stupid (even if they are stupid), nor do I belittle them for being human, also known as being frustrated.  I guess we have very different stances on what "service" to others means.

Edited by norcalnative707x
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I'm glad I stumbled on this thread.
It was purely by chance but explains my last 2 days of hell.

My work in Excel was driving me nuts and I was blaming some of my recent VBA macro changes only to discover MBAM was the culprit.

I don't mind the current MBAM bug as the workaround is simple until the next release BUT my problems, the other thread posters, all the other poor sods currently in the same predicament (but don't even know it) and all the future ones to come could have had this side-stepped by a simple mass email to all your Pro clients.

You that regard, you have dropped the ball.

Edited by mta
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